8The beast you saw was once alive but isn’t now. And yet he will soon come up out of the bottomless pit and go to eternal destruction. And the people who belong to this world, whose names were not written in the Book of Life before the world was made, will be amazed at the reappearance of this beast who had died. 9“This calls for a mind with understanding: The seven heads of the beast represent the seven hills where the woman rules. They also represent seven kings. 10Five kings have already fallen, the sixth now reigns, and the seventh is yet to come, but his reign will be brief. 11“The scarlet beast that was, but is no longer, is the eighth king. He is like the other seven, and he, too, is headed for destruction. 12The ten horns of the beast are ten kings who have not yet risen to power. They will be appointed to their kingdoms for one brief moment to reign with the beast. 13They will all agree to give him their power and authority. 14Together they will go to war against the Lamb, but the Lamb will defeat them because He is Lord of all lords and King of all kings. And his called and chosen and faithful ones will be with him.”
Revelation 17:8-14
We have another decision to make, where does the verse before this section fit?
7“Why are you so amazed?” the angel asked. “I will tell you the mystery of this woman and of the beast with seven heads and ten horns on which she sits.”
I have come to the conclusion that the mystery surrounds both the woman and the beast. Hence in verse seven the angel asks “Why are you so amazed?” Amazed about what? The woman and the beast! Hence the angel explains both the mystery of the woman and the mystery of the beast. There are two statements we need to note.
- Why are you so amazed?
- This calls for a mind with understanding.
There are two puzzles or mysteries to explain. The mystery of the woman lies in the multiple interpretations as to who she represents as I have explained in the last two Gems. The mystery of the beast is a separate mystery altogether and is introduced by the second statement: “This calls for a mind with understanding.”
Following which we have:
The seven heads of the beast represent the seven hills where the woman rules. They also represent seven kings. 10Five kings have already fallen, the sixth now reigns, and the seventh is yet to come, but his reign will be brief. 11“The scarlet beast that was, but is no longer, is the eighth king. He is like the other seven, and he, too, is headed for destruction. 12The ten horns of the beast are ten kings who have not yet risen to power. They will be appointed to their kingdoms for one brief moment to reign with the beast. 13They will all agree to give him their power and authority. 14Together they will go to war against the Lamb, but the Lamb will defeat them because He is Lord of all lords and King of all kings. And his called and chosen and faithful ones will be with him.”
Revelation 17:9-14
Read those second verses again! You have to admit that is rather enigmatic. Decipher that if you are able.
Gordon Fee wrote, As clear as the following interpretation is in most of its parts, there are just enough moments of doubt to cause one to be less than dogmatic. This is especially so regarding the seven kings of verse 10, an interpretation on John’s part that has generally played havoc with our later attempts to fit the book into what we know about the Roman emperors in the first century.
Revelation, Gordon Fee p 235
Leon Morris sees there are but one mystery for these two. They belong intimately together and to know the one is to know the other. But adds that fitting 10 emperors into the statement is a problem. Besides what is the reason for removing the three short reigning kings from the list? Quoting Hendriksen, he thinks the emperors could be empires.
Leon Morris, Revelation, Tyndale Commentaries, p. 210
David E. Aune sees a three fold formula used to introduce the beast.
- The beast was and is not and will ascend from the abyss and goes to destruction. Revelation 17:8a
2. The people of the world will be amazed at the reappearance of this beast who had died. Revelation 17:8b
3. The beast was and is no longer and is headed to destruction. Revelation 17:11a
How do we interpret this enigmatic passage? As Fee wrote above, it is hard to fit John’s statement into the historical record of the Roman kings (Caesars). Here is the list of Roman Caesars who reigned in the First Century AD:-
- Julius Caesar (101 – 44 BC)
- Augustus (27 BC – 14 AD)
- Tiberius (14 – 37 AD)
- Gaius (37 – 41 AD)
- Claudius (41 – 54 AD)
- Nero (54 – 68 AD)
- Galba (June 68 – Jan 69 AD)
- Otho (69 AD)
- Vitellius (69 AD)
- Vespasian (69 – 79 AD)
- Titus (79 – 81 AD)
- Domitian (81 – 96 AD)
- [“The Other” Neronic Antichrist (17:10b)]
- Nerva (96 – 98 AD)
Marcus Aurelius was the last Emperor of the Pax Romana period and reigned from 161-180 AD. These emperors listed above are those likely to be considered to hold a role in John’s ‘list of ten’. How does one harmonise this list with what John has written in Revelation 17? That is the challenge. Basically John’s outline either fits the list of Roman Caesars or it doesn’t. As indicated by Gordon Fee’s comment above, John’s statement appears to play havoc with what we know of the order of the Roman caesars (read kings).
Firstly, should Julius Caesar be counted or not? Would such a list start with Julius Caesar? In all probability – Yes. Julius Caesar lent his name as it were to the Caesars. His family name or cognomen was adopted after he accepted the title of Imperator and upon his deification, when that happened the name Caesar was adopted by all subsequent emperors. Thus it is fitting in a list of caesars to start with Julius. Suetonius listed Julius first in his work ‘Lives of the Caesars‘. Chrysostom and Josephus refer to Augustus as the second caesar. However, Claudius’ history of the caesars started at the death of Julius, placing Augustus first in his list. Tacitus also referred to Augustus first in his Annals.
If you count seven kings beginning with Julius, including the three short term emperors, then Galba would be the seventh (the ‘other’ who reigned a short time). But if you begin with Julius and exclude the three emperors who reigned briefly during AD 68 and 69, as many scholars do, then Claudius would be the 5th. That would make Nero the 6th and Vespasian the seventh, who was to reign a short time. However Vespasian reigned for eleven years, hardly a short time in the scheme of emperors. Vespasian and Domitian were the longest serving of the emperors in the latter half of the first century. So that’s not the answer.
If the three shortest reigning Caesars were combined together and you start at Augustus, Nero would be the 5th then Galba would be ‘the one reigning for a short time’, Vespasian would be 6th and Titus would be the one to come whose reign would be brief. Titus was known to be in poor health. The 8th king would then be Domitian or the Nero-like one who would be the scarlet beast who is no longer but will return. In all likelihood this likely related to the myth of the ‘reincarnation’ of Nero redivivus. (See Gems 2305 and 2311).
Another aspect to include in this discussion or related to the conclusion we come to concerns the use of “fallen” in Revelation 17:10. The Greek verb [πίπτω] or the infinitive [πίπτεῖν] carries the connotation of not just fallen but to be overthrown or being killed violently. What is interesting is the number of Roman emperors who died violently.
- Julius Caesar was stabbed 23 times.
- Caligula was stabbed or run through repeatedly with swords.
- Claudius was poisoned.
- Nero committed suicide.
- Galba was stabbed by many swords, decapitated and his body mutilated.
- Otho died by suicide with a dagger.
- Vitellius was beaten to death.
- Domitian was assassinated by dagger.
In actual fact the first five kings are irrelevant. The importance is placed on the 8th king who is the one coming like another Nero. We have to approach the conclusions we draw from the facts before us with a large portion of caution. We can’t be sure given our vantage point in history whether John counted from Julius Caesar or Augustus, nor can we be sure whether his list included all or any of the short term Caesars of AD 68-69. How did the hearers and / or readers in John’s time interpret these words recorded for us all? It appears as though all of what was recorded as the angel gave John revelation was to happen within a short time in their future time frame. They certainly did not have the long lead time we have had, to ponder the significance nor the likely scenarios.
David E Aune divides the likely scenarios or theories into three:
- The Historical Approach – covered in this Gem.
- The Symbolic Approach
- The Symbolic – Historical Approach
I received this response from Michael Martens regarding this Gem. I agree with him on those aspects he has commented on and so I am taking the simple option of adding his comments to this previous Gem as an addendum.
I don’t count Julius. He was a powerful military leader. He invaded Rome with his army and had total control but he was killed before he actually became Emperor. Augustus is commonly called the founder of the Roman Empire. [I agree, but there is much debate among the commentators.]
The interpretation that I find attractive is
- “Five have fallen” – i.e., Augustus, Tiberius, Gaius (Caligula), Claudius, Nero
- “The 6th now reigns” – i.e., Vespasian
- “The 7th is yet to come but his reign will be brief” – i.e., Titus (reigned for 2 years)
- “The scarlet beast… is the eighth king….” – i.e., Domitian.
Some early church fathers said that John was writing about the persecution under Domitian. He was like a second Nero. But Nero persecuted Christians only in Rome as far as we know. Domitian demanded to be called “Dominus et Deus” (Lord and God), and the cult of emperor worship was reportedly strong outside of Rome, including in Asia Minor, where the 7 churches were. [True indeed, Michael]
Or course, this interpretation may be WHY some church fathers said that Domitian was the Beast. I.e., the testimony of the church father is not reliable evidence for this interpretation. It may be nothing more than that they also followed this interpretation, and so surmised that Domitian was the Beast.
I have also read commentators who thought that the seven kings are actually 7 world kingdoms. Babylon? Egypt? Medo-Persian? Greek? Roman ?– I don’t remember how they came up with 7. [Wait for Gem 2348 where I will address this approach.]
How frustrating. Even when the angel “explains” the meaning of the vision to John, we can’t figure out the explanation! [Oh, ain’t that true. More to come on that one!]
Michael Martens
In the next Gem I will look at another approach and suggest what I believe could well have been John’s intent.
To refuse to acknowledge Caesar as Lord under the Romans was a likely death sentence. To then shout “Jesus is LORD and King of kings” was to invite tribulation upon yourself.
Ian
A day hemmed in prayer is less likely to come unravelled.
Rick Godwin
Peace doesn’t come from finding a lake with no storms. It comes from having Jesus in the boat.
John Ortberg
Don’t be afraid of dying for your faith. The three people I know, who were martyred and brought back to life, felt no pain during the experience. If God says He will protect all who are His to the end, He will.
Ian